Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
As I mentionedelsewhere, I can't even logon to 401k site this morning. This is not over yet. Assets will flee PIMCO. Not sure all of them go to Janus though. The Janus fund has to go into 401k plans first. Also large institutional investors will not rush to Janus with its reputation. Doubleline, Vanguard, Loomis Sayles, TCW/MetWest and to some extent TRP I think will be the benefeciaries.
I'm actually wondering if moving out of Pimco is a good idea now that the proverbial horse has left the barn. For most retail investors it will be 2-3 days and most likely more than that to get their funds out. This situation is exceptional. I think the new management should deserve a chance if and only if one had a long time frame to invest.
I have no horse in this race. IMHO looks like a slow motion train wreck going back over several years. Now with SEC problems on top of this it will be a year at a minimum before this the dust settles out at best! You can't turn a ship this big on a dime. Just my 2 cents.
I own PASAX, which accounts for about 3.5% of my overall portfolio. I am currently watching as I have some long term capital gains in this fund as I have owned it for some time now. However, it is a fund-of-funds and if other Pimco funds are taking it on the chin, and begin to falter, this one most likely will too. If I see a price drop down to about five percent below its 52 week high them I am thinking strongly of letting it go and not waiting to read Morningstar under review take. It is currently trading at about 3.75% off its 52 week high and has a year-to-date gain of about 4.1% (I'll want to be out with some positive gain left).
Did Pimco move away from the Bill Gross model or did Bill Gross move away from the Pimco model? Or has the Bill Gross model had its time and is now over? I dunno. I will fault Pimco for liking the Bill Gross model a little too much - he became the public face of the company and I don't feel like they were planning ahead for the potential time when that would be over.
I'm not so sure that all of the Pimco TR money will move to Janus along with him - I think some will go to Doubleline, some will go to T Rowe and elsewhere, as others have said.
PIMCO is, and has been for a few years, MUCH more than Bill Gross. They already have, and have had, a team approach on the investment committee that sets the macro outlook for the firm's funds, a top-notch analyst staff, and a solid group of fund managers whose initials aren't BG. I think there's WAY too much of the heroic-CEO-uber-alles POV being expressed in the financial media and here at MFO about Gross's move out. It's a GOOD thing for PIMCO, maybe not for the TR fund and etf for now, but for the firm as a whole.
Excellent observations. Some may see all this as damage control to stem the tide of redemptions. It will be interesting to note when that outflow starts to slow.
Similar to @Gary, I have no investments with PIMCO. If I did, my concern would mostly be about all the distraction. Of course not everyone is answering questions about BG, but considering the media coverage it wouldn't be surprising if a lot of fund managers were spending an unusual amount of time trying to convince their shareholders that nothing has changed for their fund, and they must be spending much more time dealing with the need to raise cash for redemptions. I think I'd look at the turnover of any fund I was in and be more likely to sell those with higher turnover just for fear that the focus would be lacking.
PIMCO is, and has been for a few years, MUCH more than Bill Gross. They already have, and have had, a team approach on the investment committee that sets the macro outlook for the firm's funds, a top-notch analyst staff, and a solid group of fund managers whose initials aren't BG. .
I don't disagree with you. However, I've seen two people from Pimco in the media: El-Erian and Gross and moreso the latter. The lack of an apparent attempt to groom a new public face for the company makes me think that there was little planning for the eventuality of a Pimco without Gross. Along the same lines, I think it's Pimco's fault for focusing so much on Gross that it made the company reliant upon him and the public perception that Gross IS (well, was) Pimco.
The lack of an apparent attempt to groom a new public face for the company makes me think that there was little planning for the eventuality of a Pimco without Gross.
Agreed. It sounds like it was a rebellion from within the #2 layer that precipitated BG's exit, and it's for sure a bad way to head into the post-Gross era, but they were already headed in that direction with the elevation of Ivascyn, Kiesel, and others. The transition had to come to a conclusion at some point, and as messy as it's turned out to be, now that it's happened, I think it's likely to turn out to be very positive for the firm.
On the 'public face' thing, I'm hoping they'll decide they don't need a single big name out there pumping on a constant basis.
Comments
I'm actually wondering if moving out of Pimco is a good idea now that the proverbial horse has left the barn. For most retail investors it will be 2-3 days and most likely more than that to get their funds out. This situation is exceptional. I think the new management should deserve a chance if and only if one had a long time frame to invest.
Anyone else agree? Or disagree?
Just my 2 cents.
Old_Skeet
I'm not so sure that all of the Pimco TR money will move to Janus along with him - I think some will go to Doubleline, some will go to T Rowe and elsewhere, as others have said.
I know Wikipedia is not a reliable source but if this part is true it could explain his erratic behavior.
"In 2014 Gross was reported as one of a number of "prominent investors [who] have taken to Transcendental Meditation".[21]"
On the 'public face' thing, I'm hoping they'll decide they don't need a single big name out there pumping on a constant basis.