These ladies always put on a 5* performance.

In autumn of 2007 we found ourselves in northern Europe as the markets crashed worldwide, and not a thing could we do. This year we will also be away in France for a month, and I'm not taking any chances with this screwball that we have inflicted upon ourselves. Today I reduced our funds down to about 5k in each one as a "holding" position, and I'll take a look at restoring the normal balances probably sometime in late June, if things seem to still be on a somewhat even keel (and also if we survive a week in Paris dodging ISIS).

@Paul: Your a day late and a dollar short when it comes to the M* Conference that Davis Snowball and other MFO staff will be attending. That information was given on 4/10/17.
Regards,
Ted
http://www.mutualfundobserver.com/discuss/discussion/32359/m-investment-conference-chicago-2017-april-26-28-mccormick-place#latest

Mutual fund X has $200 worth of assets, and has 10 shares outstanding. I go to the distributor of fund X, hand it $20. I am issued one share. Fund X now has $220 worth of assets, and with 11 shares outstanding, each share represents a 1/11 interest in those assets, i.e. $20.
You may choose to view this as my getting a single share of the fund, a security worth $20 based on current market price. Or you may choose to regard this transaction as providing me a 1/11 interest (worth $20) in a $220 portfolio of securities and cash. Either way, I've received 100c on the dollar. No overhead.
When one purchases shares through a DRIP plan, one may even get a discount. See, e.g. WTR's plan (5% discount on dividend reinvestments).
Not many companies offer DRIPs at discounts with no set up fees, no maintenance fees, no purchase fees, but a few like WTR do. (WTR does charge an annual fee if you want the shares in an IRA.) Can't say it never happens.

Howdy folks,
War is 'destruction economics'. You use up bullets and bombs and have to make more. You take your unemployed and put them in uniform and have to replace them accordingly. Geez, the Egyptians building pyramids added more value.
Bring the troops home and defend the shores and you could cut the defense budget by $60B/year while making them stronger and better equipped and trained. cretins.
BTW, here is George Patton's real speech. Put the kids to bed first.
http://www.pattonhq.com/speech.html
And as someone coming up on my 50th anniversary, here at the top quotes from our current SOD - Mad Dog Mattis who was CG of the 1stMarDiv
http://freebeacon.com/national-security/the-best-from-mad-dog-mattis/
and so it goes,
peace,
Sgt. O
CoA, 1stReconBn, 1st Marine Division, RVN 3/68-11/69

@Old_Skeet,
MSFAX/MSFBX is not the same fund as MGGPX. The former holds over 50% consumer defensive, is above average risk and high returns (according to the M* snapshot page). The latter is almost 40% tech and high risk (no returns rating). Both are top ten percentile over many time frames.
Not sure if they would be complimentary, or if they have some overlap. I'm looking at adding one or both. MS actually has some decent funds (that can be purchased LW at Fido)...

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1105128/000168028917000111/20170418scoutfunds497.htm
497 1 20170418scoutfunds497.htm
Scout Investments
Scout International Fund
Scout Emerging Markets Fund
Scout Global Equity Fund
Scout Equity Opportunity Fund
Scout Mid Cap Fund
Scout Small Cap Fund
Scout Low Duration Bond Fund
Scout Core Bond Fund
Scout Core Plus Bond Fund
Scout Unconstrained Bond Fund
(collectively, the "Funds")
Supplement dated April 20, 2017 to the Prospectus dated October 31, 2016, as supplemented
The following supplements the information about the Funds' investment adviser, Scout Investments, Inc. ("Scout"), included in the Prospectus. Scout is a wholly-owned subsidiary of UMB Financial Corporation ("UMB").
On April 20, 2017, UMB announced that it signed a definitive agreement to sell Scout to Carillon Tower Advisers, Inc. (the "Transaction"). The Transaction is subject to certain regulatory approvals, as well as other conditions to closing. In connection with this announcement, the Funds' Board of Trustees will meet to consider various matters related to the Transaction affecting the Funds. The Funds' Prospectus will be further supplemented to announce the Board's determinations.
You should keep this Supplement for future reference. Additional copies of the Prospectus may be obtained free of charge by calling (800) 996-2862.
Scout Investments

I think we're all in agreement that funds (whether OEF or ETF) provide a valuable service for which they deserve fair compensation (management fees) and fees to cover reasonable costs (legal fees, servicing your account, handling proxy material, etc.).
Open end shares and exchange traded shares are two ways to gain access to this service. ISTM that the more middlemen that are involved, the more costs are layered on, even if they're not called out explicitly. These might include spreads with ETFs, and shelf space fees at brokerages for OEFs (especially ones sold NTF).
One may feel that these additional fees are also worth it for value received. But if one does not want to pay the middleman (explicitly or implicitly), then one needs to go directly to the fund sponsor. That's something one can't do with an ETF. (One also can't do that with CEFs or with some open end fund companies like Janus, that sell to retail customers only via brokers.)
That's what I meant by getting $10K of securities for $10K. I don't want to pay the middleman. (Though I confess that I find Fidelity's $5 fee worth the price to gain the convenience of not having to open yet another account elsewhere.)
There can be oddball cases. Vanguard Emerging Market Index fund used to charge a fee (I think it was 1%) when you bought open end shares of the fund. This was to cover the trading costs incurred by the fund in procuring stocks with your investment dollars.
That fee made it possible for the ETF share class VWO to be cheaper to buy, at least assuming the market price was close to the NAV. All you had to pay for the ETF was the spread and any commissions. So you might get $9950 worth of securities by buying the ETF (after all trading costs were considered), as opposed to only $9900 worth of securities by buying the OEF (after paying the 1% entry fee).

I'm not really following the "black box" concept being applied to DSENX. It's pretty straight forward it invest in the S&P 500 sectors deemed to have the most value and along with that a fixed income allotment that are swaps and/or derivatives. Heck, most PIMCO funds do that and possibly many other of your favorite fund families. I may not understand the exact formula for DSENX, but I can see the result over the past year+ that I've owned it. Apparently the concept is not for everyone, but that's ok by me. I'm good until the day it doesn't out-perform.
That said, I wouldn't touch the European version now. It would need some kind of track record for me. We can call it 'the same' and "should" have the same edge as the domestic version of CAPE if we want, but prove it first is my philosophy to any brand new fund.

War is good for the stock market only if your side is winning:

Hi @Art,
My bad.
Retirement is going well and I have been at the coast over Easter with family and friends. Golf ... Teeing it up this afternoon with my golf league group of 25 years or so. At 69, I am still hitting from the white tees while some have moved up to the senior tees that are my junior. We shoot at points so once you have qualified from either the senior tees or white tees you've got to score plus to win, place or show. I'd rather shoot at less points and be on the white tees than more points and be on the senior tees.
Since, you named it (MSFBX) first ... you are now the big dog.
Skeet

@BobC
I agree. Not only is this a black box, but it is a lack box that is not even in a traditional alternative category or trying to beat a traditional type index. The Upside seems pretty positive but it also generally looses more than the SP500 especially for the last year.
I find investing hard enough without owning something I can't define, even if it is run by two very smart guys

All those swaps. Makes me feel "ooky." No way. I know the US-version has done well, too.
"They're altogether ooky, the Addams family."

If I want to buy a $10K interest the Vanguard 500 portfolio, I could pay exactly $10K for VFIAX. Or I could pay a bit more for VOO shares representing the same $10K interest in the portfolio because of the added cost of the spread. I'd prefer not to pay more than $10K for $10K worth of securities.
Regardless of how large or small that added cost is, it is a drawback inherent in the ETF design. Though perhaps it is one that you may not personally care about.
Regarding the size of that spread, Ted's 1 basis point spread is more the exception than the rule. For example, CAPE has a typical spread of 15 basis points. Here's Vanguard's table of spreads on its ETF share class.
With SPY and VFINX Ted is comparing oranges and tangerines (close but still different). The question was what downsides there were to ETFs, not whether ETF 1 was better or worse than OEF 2.
The only way I know to do an apples to apples comparison using concrete funds rather than discussing different attributes of ETFs and OEF is to compare ETF and OEF shares of the same underlying portfolio. Say VFIAX vs. VOO. Since these are shares of the same portfolio, and since they have the same ER, the only factors affecting performance should be due to the nature of the shares and not of the particular fund.
Here's the M* comparison over the past ten years.
As of April 18, 2017, VFIAX'sVOO's cumulative return was 97.23%, while VOO's was 96.59%. That doesn't include dinging VOO for the cost of the spread.
If you add SPY to the M* comparison chart, you'll find its performance was even worse, at 95.66%. But that's because of the design of the fund (cash drag due to UIT structure plus higher ER). Those additional variables confound the data.
A tip for the linkster - to link to a M* page comparing funds, one needs to link to the chart page (there's a "share this chart" link there). The only fund that shows up when one links to a M* performance page is the original fund; the compared funds don't get passed through the link.

Hi @AndyJ,
Thanks for the come back comment.
Interestingly, the MACD recently went to negative bias for the S&P 500 Index. And, I guess I could start using it for my technical strength feed but my past data comes form the RSI & MFI. However, I am going to start recording MACD data to see how it goes and possibly how to scale it into the barometer.
Skeet

Hi @JoJo26,
I'm wondering if MSFAX is a fund that you own? Being an institutional fund the threshold to purchase is 5mil ... Do you know where it can be purchased back of the 5 mil?
Nice looking fund; but, beyond my capacity at 5mil!
Edit: After seeking out my own answer to the above question I found that IGFAX is the retail class for this fund and has no min or sales load and holds just short of 30 positions.
Trailing note: After running a performace test screen I'm sticking with THOAX although IGFAX (retail version) is far from being a shabby fund.

MSFBX is available on many platforms as a no-load/NTF.

And if you're one of those "do-gooders" with a tobacco-free mandate, then the fund certainly isn't for you. 3 top 10 positions are tobacco companies and this has been a historical bias because of their strong free cash flow generation.

Hi @JoJo26,
I'm wondering if MSFAX is a fund that you own? Being an institutional fund the threshold to purchase is 5mil ... Do you know where it can be purchased back of the 5 mil?
Nice looking fund; but, beyond my capacity at 5mil!
Edit: After seeking out my own answer to the above question I found that IGFAX is the retail class for this fund and has no min or sales load and holds just short of 30 positions.
Trailing note: After running a performace test screen I'm sticking with THOAX although IGFAX (retail version) is far from being a shabby fund.

MSFBX is available on many platforms as a no-load/NTF.

T Rowe Price US High Yield Fund registration filing:
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/754915/000075491517000016/uhy2ndfiling485a.htm
(Approximate Date of Proposed Public Offering May 22, 2017)

Hi @JoJo26,
I'm wondering if MSFAX is a fund that you own? Being an institutional fund the threshold to purchase is 5mil ... Do you know where it can be purchased back of the 5 mil?
Nice looking fund; but, beyond my capacity at 5mil!
Edit: After seeking out my own answer to the above question I found that IGFAX is the retail class for this fund and has no min or sales load and holds just short of 30 positions.
Trailing note: After running a performace test screen I'm sticking with THOAX although IGFAX (retail version) is far from being a shabby fund.

@MFO Members: Nonsense ! The truth is some thinly traded ETFs have very wide bid/ask spreads even if they hold very liquid stocks. The spread is the difference between the lowest price a trader is willing to sell the ETF and the highest price a buyer is willing to pay. The wider the spread, the bigger the immediate loss upon buying the ETF. Here is the current spread on SPY the worlds largest fund with 230.5 billion in assets. Bid/Ask/Spread 234.08/234.09. QQQ with 46.1 billion in assets 131.96/ 131.97.
Regards,
Ted