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Good Smithsonian Article on the (Missing) Titan Tourism / Research Sub
Thought some might enjoy this article published before the disappearance of the sub and 5 occupants on a dive down to the Titanic. Sounds like they’ve been experimenting with a lighter weight (carbon fiber) structure than traditional steel hulled subs. The lighter weight made the vessel cheaper to transport, launch and recover than traditional deep sea vessels.
Decent reports on NPR today. Had no idea these thrill seekers paid $250K person for the trip. Reporter said he’d been aboard in the past and trips often had major glitches, rarely delivering much time below seeing the Titanic.
”Carbon fiber composites can be stronger and lighter than steel, making a submersible naturally buoyant. But they can also be prone to sudden failure under stress.”
Reading the Smithsonian story it sounds like they put a lot of faith in technology to monitor stresses on the hull all the time and to abort the dive if the hull was in danger of fracturing. Would you rather be inside something “built like a tank” (steel) or something much lighter weight, but with sophisticated computer software watching over you?
12,000 feet down? I can’t even begin to imagine that kind of depth. Immense pressures of course.
The reporter (maybe David Pogue ex-of NYT) said during Here and Now yesterday that the submersible is "controlled" by a video game controller. Good grief! By transporting the sub on another boat, then launching it in international waters, the company avoids all rules and regs regarding passenger safety or strength of the hull.
@LewisBraham Spot on. But what’s new? It’s all about grabbing eyeballs, amping-up the ratings and making more money. We could disparage the networks for operating that way I suppose; but to an extent they’re forced into the game by the need to compete. Per Pogo … the fault lies with us - in this case the public’s insatiable appetite for the sensational. This infatuation with the sensational and the constant pursuit of eyeballs by media is also leading to political and social polarization and taking down democracy in the process.
I was briefly encouraged when the fledging NewsNation cable news network first came on the air. They tried to steer a more substantive, even handed, low-key approach to some serious issues. Now, it seems they’ve “got religion” and have joined the descending caravan into the abyss of the sensational.
As far as the missing sub goes, I know there are some technological savvy members here and thought they might be interested in the technical aspects of the submersible. Reason for the post. That’s all. No intent on my part to elevate it to the level of human suffering you referenced. And, ISTM the participants here have largely been interested in the technology involved.
Well … err … until you chimed in.
We could get deeper into the weeds if people wanted. It’s been substantiated that the disappearance of a white child - especially one from a well known or privileged family receives far more media coverage than a similar incident involving of a child of color or of a different nationality. Is the media biased? Good question. But more likely it heartens back to that never ending need to grab eyeballs (albeit while playing to existing societal racism). .
Seems more about class in this case as a Pakistani billionaire is on the Titanic sub and 300 much poorer Pakistani refugees died in the migrant boat disaster and there is far less coverage. I think both stories are equally sensational in their details. It's just the calculus of value of human life is different in the press when billionaires are involved.
ISTM you’re being a bit overly harsh Lewis. It’s a sensational story. Five guys get bolted into a tin can and descend to unimaginable depths to see the fabled Titanic. It’s really dark and dangerous and cold down there. I think that’s most of the appeal to the public. Of course, your criticism also applies to the Titanic. Would the public fascination with the ship be as intent had it been transporting poor immigrants to the U.S. from Europe when it sank? (You got me on that one.)
Geez, putting the very real human tragedy aside, the aura surrounding the missing vessel does provide some respite from an incessant media drumbeat of … “Trump, Trump, Trump, Hunter, Hunter, Hunter, Durham, Durham Durham!”
“We live in The United States of Diversion.” - Bill O’Reilly
I would say there’s plenty of intrigue, drama, a potentially sensational coverup, etc. in the refugee trawler story as well to keep viewers/readers interested if the press wants to cover it more. The question remains why is the press devoting so much more space to one story over the other? Why also are so much government resources going towards one rescue effort while many of the trawler refugees remain missing as well?
Pakistani nationals appear to have been singled out on the trawler that sank off Greece last Wednesday with hundreds of passengers feared dead.
Macabre details have emerged of conditions on the boat, as questions mount over whether the Greek coastguard “covered up” its role in the tragedy. With about 500 people still feared missing, new accounts from survivors indicate that women and children were forced to travel in the hold, and that certain nationalities were condemned to the most dangerous part of the trawler.
According to leaked testimonies told by survivors to coastguards, Pakistanis were forced below deck, with other nationalities allowed on the top deck, where they had a far greater chance of surviving a capsize.
The testimonies suggest women and children were effectively “locked up” in the hold, ostensibly to be “protected” by men on the overcrowded vessel. The Observer has learned that Pakistani nationals were also kept below deck, with crew members maltreating them when they appeared in search of fresh water or tried to escape.
No women or children are thought to be among the survivors, while reports from Pakistan on Saturday indicate hundreds of its citizens may have died when the rusty trawler sank off the Peloponnese peninsula. Local media reported that at least 298 Pakistanis died, 135 from the Pakistani side of Kashmir.
One estimate indicated about 400 Pakistanis were on board. The country’s ministry of foreign affairs has so far confirmed that only 12 of the 78 survivors were from Pakistan. Conditions on the boat were so bleak that even before it sank there had already been six deaths after it ran out of fresh water.
Nawal Soufi, a Moroccan-Italian social worker and activist, added that passengers were pleading for help a day before it sank. “I can testify that these people were asking to be saved by any authority” she said. Her account contradicts that of the Greek government, which said passengers told the coastguard no request for help was made because they wanted to go to Italy.
New testimony also indicates that the trawler’s engine failed days before it sank, making it likely the crew would have sought help. “We started the journey at dawn on Friday. Around 700 of us were on board,” one migrant is recorded as saying in testimony taken by coastguards overseeing the inquiry into the disaster. “We were travelling for three days and then the engine failed.”
Four days after one of the worst disasters in the Mediterranean in recent years, the discrepancy is only one of a series of unanswered questions, including what prompted the vessel to capsize. Of concern are claims that it overturned in the early hours of Wednesday because a rope was attached by coastguards, allegations rejected by Greek officials. At first, the coastguard said it had kept a “discreet distance” from the boat, but on Friday a government spokesman confirmed a rope had been thrown to “stabilise” the boat.
Maurice Stierl, of the Institute for Migration Research and Intercultural Studies at Osnabrück University in Germany, said: “The Hellenic coastguard speaks of a sudden shift in weight. So what caused the sudden shift in weight? Was there a panic on board? Did something happen during the attempt to provide them with something? Or was it towed? And due to this towing, did the boat go down?” There are also questions over whether the Greek coastguard should have intervened earlier to escort the ageing trawler to safety. Government officials have confirmed patrol boats and cargo ships had been shadowing the trawler since Tuesday afternoon.
Some believe the failure to intervene cannot be explained by incompetence. Stierl accused many EU countries of “weaponising time” by delaying rescue as long as they can, or what he called a “phase of strategic neglect and abandonment.” He said: “They have managed to build in delays into European engagement at sea. They’re actively sort of hiding, in fact, from migrant boats, so that they are not drawn into rescue operations. We can see how a strategy is being created, that slows down –actively and consciously slows down – rescue efforts.” On Monday attention will turn to the alleged Egyptian smuggling ring in charge of the vessel, with nine suspects due in court.
The southern border issue in the USA will be resolved when all of those countries to the south of us find a way among themselves to become First World countries. Then the desire and demand to migrate north--- with nothing except whatever you can carry--- will be substantially reduced, methinks. (So does actor Edward James Olmos, as interviewed back in the 1990s at the Mexican border on CNN.)
Africa, too, is a basket case. Some countries in Asia, too. I think economically, Vietnam has stalled. And look at what the scumpigs are doing in Burma. Aung San Suu Kyi may have lost her status as an immaculate heroine. (See what has been happening to the Rohingya.) But she is still being persecuted. ...Philippines? Hopelessly corrupt. And on and on.
Meanwhile, the USA is falling down on the job. In short order, we are falling apart from within. Just the way we were taught that the Roman Empire fell. I suppose it is inevitable that all Empires fall.
Hello, Lewis. I argue with not a word of that. And I can recall listening LIVE on the radio while the coup vs. Allende in Chile was actually happening.
Nevertheless, at some point, the process of reclaiming and rebuilding must take hold. I recall the Aquino "revolution" connected to Corazon Aquino. And her trademark yellow dress. Even the Catholic Cardinal Sin ("Seen") supported her. With good reason. But the revolution dissipated. The corruption never was diminished.
A very practical example: Philippine Airlines, run by Lucio Tan. He does not play nice with others, and so Philippine Airlines is not a member of any of the major airline cooperative associations, like OneWorld or SkyTeam. ...Why do individual travelers have to pay an exit fee to leave the airport(s) in the Philippines? (The only direct international flights are from either Cebu or Manila.) It's because the gov't cannot trust PAL to collect the proper tax and actually send it to the gov't. So, you get a green passport stamp upon arrival. When you leave, you get the red passport stamp, after you've paid the fee. The Philippines government had to sue the airline to reclaim the tax money from PAL. It took years and years and years and YEARS in their courts, but eventually the gummint won their case. There are a gazillion ways people find NOT to pay taxes in that country. And the gummint doesn't seem to have a way to effectively collect what it's owed. So there's no social safety net. And kids have to pay for everything, even in "public" schools.
In Central America, I visited Honduras only briefly. (And in Mexico, Tijuana and San Felipe, on the Sea of Cortez.) Some of us flew down to help out a town that was (at last) relocated inland from the coast, after Hurricane Mitch. After a couple of YEARS, they still did not have electricity up and running. So much for public utilities. They were using solar ovens, as long as there were days with enough sunshine. The people there finally got their electricity about 2 weeks after we flew back to the States. I was engaged in digging a very long slit-trench to drain the water away from the houses. (Mosquitos and malaria!) Life is so elemental and basic. A truck came along and parked for a while. It was full of empty soda pop bottles. A GUARD stood by it with a Thompson gun, or some such. Maybe a Kalashnikov. Guarding EMPTIES. Jayzuz. That one visual moment told me a lot. ***** From your Wiki article: "In the early 20th century, during the "Banana Republic" era of Latin American history, the U.S. launched several interventions and invasions in the region (known as the Banana Wars) in order to promote American business interests.[1]"
Let's not forget that HAWAII was stolen from its rightful monarchy, which was indeed supported by the people. Queen Emma and King Kamehameha IV got the entire "Queens's Medical Center" system underway. Today it is the premier hospital system for the islands. People fly-in from neighbor islands to "Queen's" in Honolulu, often. Not every special need can be handled on the other islands. I know people who have flown in from Guam to get procedures done here, and not just at "Queen's."
The crown was stolen from Liliuokalani in 1895 in a coup led by the criminal pig named Dole. (Bananas, pineapples, everything.) He became President of the U.S.- installed provisional gov't, until Hawaii became officially a Territory. (And guess where I happen to live? On DOLE Street!)
Comments
”Carbon fiber composites can be stronger and lighter than steel, making a submersible naturally buoyant. But they can also be prone to sudden failure under stress.”
Reading the Smithsonian story it sounds like they put a lot of faith in technology to monitor stresses on the hull all the time and to abort the dive if the hull was in danger of fracturing. Would you rather be inside something “built like a tank” (steel) or something much lighter weight, but with sophisticated computer software watching over you?
12,000 feet down? I can’t even begin to imagine that kind of depth. Immense pressures of course.
I was briefly encouraged when the fledging NewsNation cable news network first came on the air. They tried to steer a more substantive, even handed, low-key approach to some serious issues. Now, it seems they’ve “got religion” and have joined the descending caravan into the abyss of the sensational.
As far as the missing sub goes, I know there are some technological savvy members here and thought they might be interested in the technical aspects of the submersible. Reason for the post. That’s all. No intent on my part to elevate it to the level of human suffering you referenced. And, ISTM the participants here have largely been interested in the technology involved.
Well … err … until you chimed in.
We could get deeper into the weeds if people wanted. It’s been substantiated that the disappearance of a white child - especially one from a well known or privileged family receives far more media coverage than a similar incident involving of a child of color or of a different nationality. Is the media biased? Good question. But more likely it heartens back to that never ending need to grab eyeballs (albeit while playing to existing societal racism).
.
Geez, putting the very real human tragedy aside, the aura surrounding the missing vessel does provide some respite from an incessant media drumbeat of … “Trump, Trump, Trump, Hunter, Hunter, Hunter, Durham, Durham Durham!”
“We live in The United States of Diversion.” - Bill O’Reilly
https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/18/pakistanis-were-forced-below-deck-on-refugee-boat-in-greece-disaster
Also found another article if you care to read.
https://news.yahoo.com/19-old-titan-passenger-terrified-223814349.html
Africa, too, is a basket case. Some countries in Asia, too. I think economically, Vietnam has stalled. And look at what the scumpigs are doing in Burma. Aung San Suu Kyi may have lost her status as an immaculate heroine. (See what has been happening to the Rohingya.) But she is still being persecuted. ...Philippines? Hopelessly corrupt. And on and on.
Meanwhile, the USA is falling down on the job. In short order, we are falling apart from within. Just the way we were taught that the Roman Empire fell. I suppose it is inevitable that all Empires fall.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change_in_Latin_America
Nevertheless, at some point, the process of reclaiming and rebuilding must take hold. I recall the Aquino "revolution" connected to Corazon Aquino. And her trademark yellow dress. Even the Catholic Cardinal Sin ("Seen") supported her. With good reason. But the revolution dissipated. The corruption never was diminished.
A very practical example: Philippine Airlines, run by Lucio Tan. He does not play nice with others, and so Philippine Airlines is not a member of any of the major airline cooperative associations, like OneWorld or SkyTeam. ...Why do individual travelers have to pay an exit fee to leave the airport(s) in the Philippines? (The only direct international flights are from either Cebu or Manila.) It's because the gov't cannot trust PAL to collect the proper tax and actually send it to the gov't. So, you get a green passport stamp upon arrival. When you leave, you get the red passport stamp, after you've paid the fee. The Philippines government had to sue the airline to reclaim the tax money from PAL. It took years and years and years and YEARS in their courts, but eventually the gummint won their case. There are a gazillion ways people find NOT to pay taxes in that country. And the gummint doesn't seem to have a way to effectively collect what it's owed. So there's no social safety net. And kids have to pay for everything, even in "public" schools.
In Central America, I visited Honduras only briefly. (And in Mexico, Tijuana and San Felipe, on the Sea of Cortez.) Some of us flew down to help out a town that was (at last) relocated inland from the coast, after Hurricane Mitch. After a couple of YEARS, they still did not have electricity up and running. So much for public utilities. They were using solar ovens, as long as there were days with enough sunshine. The people there finally got their electricity about 2 weeks after we flew back to the States. I was engaged in digging a very long slit-trench to drain the water away from the houses. (Mosquitos and malaria!) Life is so elemental and basic. A truck came along and parked for a while. It was full of empty soda pop bottles. A GUARD stood by it with a Thompson gun, or some such. Maybe a Kalashnikov. Guarding EMPTIES. Jayzuz. That one visual moment told me a lot.
*****
From your Wiki article:
"In the early 20th century, during the "Banana Republic" era of Latin American history, the U.S. launched several interventions and invasions in the region (known as the Banana Wars) in order to promote American business interests.[1]"
Let's not forget that HAWAII was stolen from its rightful monarchy, which was indeed supported by the people. Queen Emma and King Kamehameha IV got the entire "Queens's Medical Center" system underway. Today it is the premier hospital system for the islands. People fly-in from neighbor islands to "Queen's" in Honolulu, often. Not every special need can be handled on the other islands. I know people who have flown in from Guam to get procedures done here, and not just at "Queen's."
The crown was stolen from Liliuokalani in 1895 in a coup led by the criminal pig named Dole. (Bananas, pineapples, everything.) He became President of the U.S.- installed provisional gov't, until Hawaii became officially a Territory. (And guess where I happen to live? On DOLE Street!)