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Here's a statement of the obvious: The opinions expressed here are those of the participants, not those of the Mutual Fund Observer. We cannot vouch for the accuracy or appropriateness of any of it, though we do encourage civility and good humor.
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    DSEEX + PONDX 50-50 beats PRWCX ... except for this year, hmm.
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    @msf
    Sure, but by the time you invested, Magellan's best days were behind it. After Ned Johnson put up annual returns averaging 30.3% you had to make do with Lynch's measly 29.2% average performance.
    Huh? Something may be off or I am misreading the graphs.
    From Magellan inception to mid-May '72, M* shows $10k going to ~$123k. ~12x.
    Ted's span from then to fall '96 shows $10k going to ~$589k, for like 59x.
    No?
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    If I could only hold 1fund, it would be a fund I don't own today, a TRP Target Date Retirement fund. If it is one fund to hold for 10-15 years in a portfolio of funds - PRWCX.
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    Which SINGLE fund? My PRWCX is my call, but let me also mention my MAPOX, for the quarterly dividends--- which is going to mean more and more to me, going forward. These hypothetical answers to the original question are due to a naturally prudent approach, assuming all monies end-up in ONE fund. If I were also granted just one choice to add a foreign element to the portfolio, it would be PRIDX. And I suppose I'd go 70% domestic and 30% foreign. (Right now, though, I'm only 11% in foreign equities.)
    My current equity allocation:
    LCV 20.41
    LCG30.55
    Smid-value 20.44
    Smid growth 28.60
    My current foreign equity funds: SFGIX and PRIDX.
  • Has A Mutual Fund Ever De-Mutualized? A "Financial Loose End" Story
    Wow, 25 shares! When Met Life demutualized, I got 10 whole shares. So little that when they spun off Brighthouse Financial I would have gotten less than one share, so I was forced to accept cash in lieu.
    I was notified about the shares when the demutualization occurred, and I was notified of the Brighthouse shares (well, cash) as well. So I'm a little surprised that you got no notifications. Perhaps the problem lies with your old insurer?
    My MET shares were held in a trust (also via Computershare) that enabled me to buy and sell shares with no commission. The Brighthouse shares would have been held there also, had there been any shares to hold. These days, one can trade stocks for next to no commission, so I don't see much value in retaining the shares in the trust.
    Be advised that the IRS has always asserted that your cost basis in the shares is zero. There is some disagreement across courts about this, but the IRS remains unmoved. https://www.journalofaccountancy.com/issues/2016/mar/basis-of-stock-in-insurance-demutualization.html
    Given the fact that I'd owe taxes on 100% of the value, or could get a deduction on 100% of the value by donating them, I figure I'll donate this year, while I can still itemize. (If the tax "reform" legislation passes, then between loss of SILT deductions and higher standard deductions, I'll not likely itemize in 2018.)
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    If I was focused only on domestic and even if I wasn't I'd at least think hard about POAGX. I don't like nothing but the US but if I had to bet which funds of the ones I currently own that I'd still own 15 years from now that would be my bet.
    I like the idea of go anywhere, do anything flexibility but there's just not many, if any, that I'd really trust with that. Since we wouldn't be able to know anything about the ups and downs along the way I wouldn't have a big issue with sticking to stocks and I'd probably go for something like Grandeur Peak's Global Opportunities or Global Stalwarts, neither of which I own.
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    Maybe its me, but I am an allocation guy when it come to paring down choices.
    My H.S.A (@ Bruce Funds) will be BRUFX
    My Roth IRA (@ TRP) will be PRWCX
    My SD IRA (@Vanguard) will be VWINX or maybe even Global Wellesley, VGWIX
    My Taxable account will be VTMFX
    A 10-15 Year Trend Funds:
    Health Care - PRHCX, VGHCX, FSMEX
    Tech - PRGTX, FSITX,
    Consumerism - FSRPX
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    It's not a bad choice but he dismissed a lot of possibilities without much consideration. It sounds like he started with the answer and needed to write a 300 word article (or whatever it is) to get there. If you've got 15 years then Schiller's CAPE ratio is pretty much the best predictor that's been found and that wouldn't really lead you to US stocks at this point.
  • Your Choice: One Mutual Fund to Hold For the Next 10-15 Years
    The linked article, though written in 2015, makes a case for the next 10-15 years.
    What would be the one mutual fund to hold for the next 10-15 years? He gives the nod to VIMSX.
    the-one-best-mutual-fund-to-hold-forever-naesx-vimsx
  • Has A Mutual Fund Ever De-Mutualized? A "Financial Loose End" Story
    As the result of a "de-mutualization" of my insurer (NE Financial merged with MET Life) I received 25 shares of MET Stock. These shares, originally held at BNY Mellon, recently were transferred to Computershare which provide shareholder services for the shares. Nothing that I initiated. In fact, I stumbles upon this revelation after doing a yearly checkup on the BNY Mellon account. I never received an email nor a mailing of this change. It was hell finding the correct department at Computershares and then proving to Computershares who I was since I was using BNY Mellon Accont information that I had screenshots of (the account nor longer was accessible to me online).
    Anyway, this year MET spun off BHF (Bright House Financial...an annuity service of MET) which provided me with 2 shares of BHF. I realize I am not going to get rich here, but these are the kinds of transactions (that even the owner has a hard time following let alone an heir). It happen all the time and these financial assets get lost in the shuffle of life.
    I mention this because my parent (a physician and original member of the formation of Mutual Hospital Insurance later known as Anthem) dead very young. My remaining parent, now 94, discovered (by another family member 40 years later) that she was the beneficiary of over $100K of WLP stock (which bought Anthem at one point in time and now WLP is traded as ANTM..don't try to keep score here).
    Here a brief history if you are interested:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthem_Inc.
    My point is... Fast forward 40 years from today my MET/BHF stock could one day be a small fortune. The power of compounding over time.
    So, organize these financial "loose" ends for yourself as well as your heirs. It may seem time consuming, but it is worth every penny of the time that you spend on it.
    Also, has a Mutual Fund ever de-mutualized?
  • Consuelo Mack's WealthTrack: Guest: Kathleen Gaffney,Manager, Eaton Vance Bond Fund
    FYI: (I will link episode as soon as it becomes available, early Saturday morning.)
    Regards,
    Ted
    November 9, 2017
    Dear WEALTHTRACK Subscriber,
    Question: what have been two of the most distinctive features of the recovery from the financial crisis of ‘08-‘09? Answer: historically low levels of inflation and interest rates. Despite years of numerous predictions to the contrary inflation has stayed stubbornly subdued and, with some help from central banks around the globe, so have interest rates. But is this nearly decade long pattern finally being broken? This week’s guest says yes and there is evidence to back her claim.
    As a recent headline in The Wall Street Journal reads: “Inflation the slumbering giant begins to stir.” To illustrate the point the Journal showed a chart of year over year changes in consumer prices in the U.K., U.S. and Eurozone. They bottomed in 2015 and have slowly risen, with fits and starts ever since… Japan has shown a similar pattern.
    Meanwhile interest rates on benchmark 10-year government bonds are rising. U.S. rates ticked higher recently and yields in Germany and Japan are off their mid-2016 lows.
    There have been other episodes of rising inflation and interest rates before this which didn’t last. This week’s guest is betting this one is for real.
    She is Kathleen Gaffney, Director of Diversified Fixed Income at Eaton Vance where she is also the lead portfolio manager of the Eaton Vance Multisector Income Fund which she launched as the Eaton Vance Bond Fund when she joined the firm in early 2013.
    The fund is known for its flexibility to seek higher total return opportunities anywhere globally and throughout the capital structure of the companies chosen. As a result it can buy common and preferred stocks, convertible securities and bonds. It also invests in currencies. That approach however has also meant “significantly more volatility” than its peers in Morningstar’s Multisector Bond category. Case in point: the fund declined 17% in 2015 and rocketed up 22% in 2016.
    Gaffney is also lead portfolio manager of the somewhat more traditional Eaton Vance Core Plus Bond Fund. It carries a 5-Star rating and has ranked in the top performance percentiles in its category for the last 1, 3 and 5 year periods, both under her leadership and that of former managers.
    If you miss the show on television you can always watch it on our website at your convenience. If you’d like to see the show before it airs, it is available to our PREMIUM subscribers right now. We also have an EXTRA interview with Gaffney about how she finds "think time" in the midst of information overload. It will be available exclusively on our website.
    If you would like to take WEALTHTRACK with you on your commute or travels, you can now find the WEALTHTRACK podcast on TuneIn, Stitcher, and SoundCloud, as well as iTunes. Find out more on the WEALTHTRACK Podcast page.
    Saturday, November 11th is Veteran’s Day. Please take a moment to remember all of those past and present, who have sacrificed so much to give us the freedoms we enjoy today. I personally salute my Dad, Husband and Son. I am so grateful for their service.
    Have a great weekend and make the week ahead a profitable and a productive one.
    Best Regards,
    Consuelo
    Video Clip:

    M* Snapshot EBABX:
    http://www.morningstar.com/funds/XNAS/EBABX/quote.htmlutm_term=0_bf662fd9c0-2b02004c36-71656893
    Lipper Snapshot: EBABX:
    https://www.marketwatch.com/investing/fund/ebabx
    EBABX Is Unranked In The (IB) Fund Category By U.S. News & World Report
  • Gundlach's Stock Market Warning Comes True
    FYI: Jeffrey Gundlach has been warning something’s got to give. Based on the past two days, looks like we have our answer.
    Stocks fell around the world a second day and high-yield bonds headed for a fourth straight loss, resuming a historic correlation that the hedge fund manager on Wednesday had warned was alarmingly out of whack.
    Regards,
    Ted
    https://www.fa-mag.com/news/gundlach-s-stock-market-warning-comes-true-35658.html?print
  • Investing Index Card
    @msf
    >> using asset allocation is mathematically equivalent to using buckets with rebalancing.
    yeah, it is from him that I got my construct notions
    >> I think one can do better with, say, an 88/12 (cash) bucket strategy without rebalancing.
    and this is what I am moving to, though you do have to sell, to replenish cash, a kind of rebalancing, seems to me
    >> After waiting it out one can replenish the cash bucket from equities. So I'm comfortable keeping a three year cushion.
    I do less than that; maybe should reconsider. Three years in cash, huh.
    >> Right now, though, I'd use cash for that cushion because bonds add risk and don't add much to returns.
    I often wonder about my Pimco allotment. Why not bail into cash? (Greed.)
    >> If a retiree (inferred from the "no income" hypothesis) has $1M and needs $40K/year, staying completely out of the market isn't unreasonable. A 65 year old male can get an annuity paying $40K/year, with 3% annual adjustments, for about $840K. He can have fun with the rest - invest, travel, build a legacy, save for unexpected expenses. Annuities are another way to mitigate risk, as Pfau discusses in his Forbes column cited previously.
    My wife has posed, if we have enough to cover expenses (@4% withdrawal), actually just enough, why not go even more conservative than our 50-50 (including SS as bond)? I usually mutter about travel, emergencies, housing loans / help / gifts to kids, future education help to grandkids, health surprises (we do have LTC), and greed.
  • Investing Index Card
    (Double-dipping here)
    Along a similar vein to the card’s professed wisdom ... the simplistic slogan I credit with turning my financial life around more than 25 years ago is: “Pay yourself first.”
    I first heard it voiced by an (ironically) unlikely mutual fund promoter of the time, Richard Strong. His Strong Capital Management used the slogan prominently in its advertising. Up to that point I’d thought of saving only as depriving oneself of something. The slogan turns that idea upside-down and makes saving sound much more like a reward. Sure helped me get turned around.
  • How to Deal with Uncertainties
    Hi Guys,
    It's not at all surprising that we quickly miss Ted's daily references. He is definitely an MFO asset who enhances the usefulness of this site.
    In his temporary medical absence, I'll contribute a reference that he unfailingly makes:
    http://awealthofcommonsense.com/2017/11/how-to-deal-with-market-moving-news/
    The article does a reasonable summary, but I believe it misses a few significant actions that an individual investor can easily do to address changing market conditions. In the spirit of the article, I propose at least one additional "avoid" rule. Avoid an immediate decision. Allow some time to more fully assess the market's reactions by not reviewing your portfolio's current value on a daily basis. That frequent review encourages an overreaction and over-trading.
    In addition to the avoidance rule set, I would also propose a "just do it" action. An investor should use a Monte Carlo simulation tool (many available for free on the Internet) to test the robustness of his portfolio to the uncertainties of future market returns.
    History demonstrates the random nature of future returns. Predicting these returns is hazardous duty and failures greatly exceed accurate forecasts. Monte Carlo methods were specifically designed to address this randomness and noisey data characteristic. You can use this tool to explore numerous what-if future scenarios in a few minutes on the computer. These codes run thousands of possible time sequential histories based on easily changed inputs. Please give this powerful tool a chance to assess the range of possible portfolio performance outcomes using a probabilistic framework. Given the uncertainties, probabilities are the best we can do.
    As a goal, I always attempted to reach a 95% plus portfolio survival likelihood. In the rare likelihood of portfolio failure, flexibility is always a saving policy.
    Best Regards
  • Investing Index Card
    A sequence of return risk always exists so long as there are withdrawals. If there are no withdrawals, it doesn't matter whether the market starts off down and then goes up, or starts off well and then declines, so long as it winds up in the same place.
    That leads to the (rhetorical) question: why use a 50/50 mix rather than simply a diversified equity portfolio? One reason is real though not especially rational - emotional discomfort in seeing numbers drop (for all the non-Vulcan investors out there :-)). Another reason is pragmatic. Withdrawals when the market is down eat away at a larger percentage of the portfolio; keeping a bond (or cash) allocation mitigates that risk.
    To be clear. We're all talking about mitigating sequence risk. We just have different views on the best way to do that. There's an interesting column by Kitces, where he shows that using asset allocation is mathematically equivalent to using buckets with rebalancing. In other words, the 50/50 portfolio is the same mitigation strategy as drawing from bonds/cash in down markets so long as one rebalances periodically.
    I think one can do better with, say, an 88/12 (cash) bucket strategy without rebalancing. Except for the dotcom bubble (that took 31 months from peak to trough), markets have generally bounced back in three years. At least most of the way. After waiting it out one can replenish the cash bucket from equities. So I'm comfortable keeping a three year cushion. Starting now, or starting anytime. Right now though, I'd use cash for that cushion because bonds add risk and don't add much to returns.
    The reason why I continue to return to the threshold question about when declines matter, is that corrections are both frequent and erratic. Like the saying that indexes predicted nine out of the last five recessions (Samuelson), one may be out of the market most of the time if one is constantly concerned about the inevitable next correction/bear. (Look at how many years people have been saying that the bond market is about to decline - we're coming up on a decade now.)
    If a retiree (inferred from the "no income" hypothesis) has $1M and needs $40K/year, staying completely out of the market isn't unreasonable. A 65 year old male can get an annuity paying $40K/year, with 3% annual adjustments, for about $840K. He can have fun with the rest - invest, travel, build a legacy, save for unexpected expenses. Annuities are another way to mitigate risk, as Pfau discusses in his Forbes column cited previously.
    Unlike the 95% success rate you mentioned, the annuity provides a 100% success rate (assuming that the AA rated insurance company doesn't fold).
    I agree with you in being concerned about a 5% chance of failure. It's not like you get 20 lifetimes and get to discard one of them. You've only got one shot at this, and you don't want to be the 1 in 20 who goes broke.
    Perhaps I've misread posts, but a response I've read seemed to say to me, "well, these 5% outliers aren't real, but just artifacts of the way the simulators work." You're never going to see in real life, for example, three years in a row of 20% declines, even if they do show up in random simulations.
    I take that not as reassurance, but reason for concern that the simulators have fundamental flaws in their design. So while I might agree that the 5% won't actually happen, I'm less sanguine about the accuracy of the other 95% of predictions.
  • Investing Index Card
    msf, did not mean to totally direct the post to you but I will answer you now. Not to get too far down in the weeds....my OP suggests that long term savings rate is important and is within direct control of the investor and secondly, at what price you establish a cost basis of your portfolio is critical.
    To put my second point in understandable terms: Would you invest $1M TODAY requiring a $40,000 inflation adjusted cash flow needs given that this market is up 3.5X from the lows? How would you answer that?
    I am drawing a conclusion from your excellent analysis that investing anytime with an appropriate withdrawal rate is acceptable. Maybe I misunderstand. I just would not feel comfortable with my $$ taking that approach after this particular bull run.
    If you need a mitigating sequence risk strategy rather than the 50/50 portfolio we began with then maybe you are suggesting you would not.
    The 95% success rate with 4% withdrawals you see in so many portfolio allocation simulation strategies looks really good unless you are in the 5% that went to zero. What was the reason for these 5%?
  • Investing Index Card
    I'm still wondering why you ignored a 19.4% drop in the market.
    Regarding the "above Portfolio Visualizer success rate analysis thru 2017 assumes ..." It makes no assumptions at all. That's what I was trying to convey in saying that backtesting works with real data. It takes the market as it performed; there are no odds, assumed or otherwise. Run it, run again, run it again, and you'll get the identical result over and over, because the past performance of the market doesn't change.
    These results of past investments are as real and meaningful as your statement that the last two (bear) market drops were 57% and 49%.
    I stated that I have significant issues with existing tools for simulations of future results. So I'm in agreement that these tools have major limitations, not just under current market conditions, but anytime. That said, I disagree with some aspects of your concerns.
    Most simulation tools use mean and standard deviation to project future results. Think bell curve centered at some point above zero (since the average return is positive). So the way they work, they figure that more than half the time the market moves up - there are more points to the right of zero than to the left. They don't assume equal odds.
    image
    A problem is that returns aren't symmetric like a bell curve. There are slightly more up days than down days, even though the up days aren't (on average) as big as down days. Here's Forbes' data on the DJIA from October 1, 1928 through January 28, 2016:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikepatton/2016/01/29/fast-facts-on-the-dow-jones-stock-index/#145fcc6a6972
    "An investors quality of life can be affected if annual income is reduced by a significant amount due to decreases in portfolio value (with static 4% withdrawal program)."
    I didn't use a "static 4% withdrawal program." I used as static, inflation adjusted dollar amount independent of portfolio performance.
    Using your $1M pot, I started with a $3,333/mo ($40K/year) draw, and adjusted that draw only for inflation. I did not increase or decrease the draw based on the value of the portfolio. I mirrored what Bengen did in his original 4% rule analysis. Only later did he suggest modifying the amount withdrawn based on portfolio value.
    In your question about what to do with a $1M inheritance, you didn't say how this person with no assets and no income was living. For the sake of argument, I'll assume his cash flow needs are $40K/year (4%), inflation adjusted.
    There are many ways of mitigating sequence risk. I've posted this link before:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/wadepfau/2017/04/12/4-approaches-to-managing-sequence-of-returns-risk-in-retirement/#2b188f486fcf
    I like Buffett's approach (which is one of the ideas in the article above - buffer assets, avoid selling at a loss). Buffett suggested keeping 10% in short term treasuries (effectively cash) and the rest in the S&P 500. Personally I'd up the cash figure to 12% or so, and diversify the equity portfolio more broadly, but that's the general idea.