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Tipping Point?

edited January 27 in Off-Topic
The reckless Minneapolis killings perpetrated by ICE and Border Patrol have angered many people.
Several congressional Republicans have even spoken out publicly against these incidents!
I previously mentioned that I believed the Trump administration would go too far and the country
would then reach a tipping point.
Are we approaching the tipping point now?

https://robertreich.substack.com/p/americas-tipping-point

Comments

  • Right now one can only hope. There are still plenty of fools towing the party line. Apparently murdering someone by shooting them in the back 9-10X while they are lying on the ground isn't enough proof that a change needs to come.

  • sadly no.
    10s of millions of MAGA support trump though any crime\disaster. trump has dismissed all their concerns save for entertainment value, and doesnt need them until prison may again be a real threat.

    each blue state is on its own. corporate america (e.g., minnesota HQed) is silent\neutral.

    worst of all, the gop has funded too many project2025 type initiatives to be retrieved before 2028.
  • If the "tipping point" is defined as driving away any swing voters that would enable GOP candidates, I would guess "yes", we have passed that point. Of course, die-hard maga will remain maga. Of course, policy reversals will be time-consuming.

    But, would trump win a POTUS election if it were held tomorrow? Highly unlikely IMO. And highly unlikely that he can change that dynamic by mid-terms. I suspect that more economic hardship is percolating and will continue to surface.
  • edited January 27
    I've resumed watching West Wing (OK - a decade or two behind most of you). Just started Season 2 which can be bought for $24.95 on Prime. One thing I had not fully appreciated is the intense attention the Prez and much of his staff pay to the polls. Incredible focus on them daily and how to affect them in a favorable manner by virtually every action or word of mouth. To some extent that's in play here. I'm trying to stay out of the gutter. I bemoan the terrible loss of two innocent lives in the tragedy playing out in Minneapolis. Holman talks a good game. Better than the dude who left town. But Homan's credibility? Highly questionable.
  • edited January 27
    For me "polls" is a very interesting subject. I also have been mentally comparing the present situation to the "West Wing" treatment, because it's been my impression that this current bunch is so focused on their attempts to fully accomplish their own and the "Project 2025" objectives that virtually none of Trump's "lieutenants" care in the slightest about polls or the public reaction. RFK, Bessent, Lutnick, Homan, Patel, Vought, or especially Miller, Hegseth, Bondi, and Noem frequently just shoot off their mouths first and don't even care about the public perception of their verbal dung.

    Definitely not true of the head rodent though... the coverage of the television establishment is just about ALL that he cares about.

    They all would have lasted about one episode in "The West Wing".

    One very major difference in comparing the two operating environments, though: in "The West Wing" the president has the normal "checks and balances" of a reasonably strong opposition party in Congress, and a reasonably balanced Supreme Court. The current rodent has absolutely no viable major opposition.
  • Yep. Thanks for long ago recommending the series. Pretty awesome. What a strong cast!
  • edited January 27
    Yes, and that's also interesting. My wife has always had a strong interest in the stage and it's performers- me, not so much, with the exception of opera performances and stage musicals. San Francisco is so fortunate to have a first-rate opera company, Gilbert and Sullivan company, and symphony orchestra.

    But in my older years with more available time I've come to admire some of the older television productions. I especially admire many of the technical aspects as well as the actors- by "technical" I don't mean the computer generated explosions and such, but the actual camerawork and directing. For example, the camera work in establishing the ambiance in the French production of the Jules Maigret detective series with Bruno Cremer is just fascinating and lovely. I've watched that entire series over and over just to immerse myself in the atmosphere, even though the plot is already well known. No explosions or car chases, and almost no gunplay.

    This has led me to do a little reading of books authored by actors in a few series. And one thing there comes through loud and clear- the great admiration that actors have for each other, the profession itself, and for the huge number of supporting crafts, technicians, and people who make the whole thing work. And one other thing that I've noticed: the respect and admiration that so many actors have for other actors who have come from the stage background. That made a real impression, because many of the specific stage actors that were mentioned were also some of my favorite performance characters in the TV work.

    No wonder you enjoy this stuff so much.
  • edited January 27
    I confess to having fallen in love with Press Secretary, "CJ" Cregg (played by Allison Janney). It would certainly be a pleasure to work alongside a woman of that intelligence and commitment to her profession. Sharp cookie. Yet, the humaneness shines through.

    "And one other thing that I've noticed: the respect and admiration that so many actors have for other actors who have come from the stage background. That made a real impression, because many of the specific stage actors that were mentioned were also some of my favorite performance characters in the TV work."

    Yep. Big difference. I'd think stage work more difficult and more rewarding. I do appreciate it more than film. No second chances, cuts, edits. Your bare ass in public and often several shows a week. Don't know how they do it.
  • Well, if you don't get anywhere with Allison Janney you might try for Karoline Leavitt...
  • @ Old_Joe: "And one other thing that I've noticed: the respect and admiration that so many actors have for other actors who have come from the stage background. That made a real impression, because many of the specific stage actors that were mentioned were also some of my favorite performance characters in the TV work."

    Yup. Scratch a good/great British actor on BBC, & you'll frequently find Royal Shakespeare Company in their background.
  • Today's WSJ: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says

    Suggested edit: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says
  • edited January 28
    hank said:

    Today's WSJ: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says

    Suggested edit: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says

    Stephen Miller referred to Alex Pretti as an assassin who tried to murder federal agents.
    Kristi Noem claimed Mr. Pretti brandished a gun and attacked officers which contradicts available video footage.
    The Trump administration's numerous lies regarding Pretti are truly despicable.
    A thorough, impartial investigation should be conducted and the perpetrators must be held accountable.
    Despite JD Vance's false assertion, ICE and Border Patrol agents do not have "absolute immunity."

    https://www.cnn.com/2026/01/25/politics/trump-officials-shifting-rhetoric-alex-pretti
  • jeez,

    there generally is no such thing as a tipping point, as we geezer oldsters know from recent history

    it's only chipping away ! (resist!)

    did Kent State have an outcome? not really.

    yes, there were hearings and more.

    the bloody war went on 5 more years

    but it did end.
  • edited January 29
    The Orange regime continues to flood the zone with all sorts of varied illegal, shocking, norm-busting, unconstitutional junk. The news we see or hear can get only so much of it across. There are only so many hours in a day. Today I learned that the weaponized FBI raided a Fulton County, GA voting location. The Orange Felon POTUS cannot admit he LOST, that year. The regime continues to invent or provoke pretexts in order to sway the '26 midterms.

    There is Executive overreach in so many directions. Where do you even begin to catalog them and prioritize them? That's by design, surely, in "Project 2025." It is proving to be a masterpiece of subversive tactics with the goal of destroying a country with Judiciary, Legislative and Exec. functions. We are finding out that checks and balances don't work when the Judiciary (not only SCOTUS) is loaded up with Orange toadies, and the Repugnant majority on The Hill has no spine. We are long past a tipping point, I'd say.
  • hank said:

    I've resumed watching West Wing (OK - a decade or two behind most of you). Just started Season 2 which can be bought for $24.95 on Prime. One thing I had not fully appreciated is the intense attention the Prez and much of his staff pay to the polls. Incredible focus on them daily and how to affect them in a favorable manner by virtually every action or word of mouth. To some extent that's in play here. I'm trying to stay out of the gutter. I bemoan the terrible loss of two innocent lives in the tragedy playing out in Minneapolis. Holman talks a good game. Better than the dude who left town. But Homan's credibility? Highly questionable.

    hank said:

    Yep. Thanks for long ago recommending the series. Pretty awesome. What a strong cast!

    When WW was first on the air, a neighbor and friend who was at least 10 years my senior, urged me to watch. A decade later I finally started watching. and was hooked immediately. I binged all seasons and introduced my teenaged son, at that time. He loved it too. I agree about the cast, the writing and Allison Janney! It was a special show, and still holds up today.
  • hank said:

    Today's WSJ: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says

    Suggested edit: Two Federal Immigration Officials Fired Shots at Alex Pretti, DHS Report Says


    Or, "Two federal Immigration Officials Fired ... out of a cannon and into the Sun".
  • Yes, just a top quality production all around. Allison Janney, of course- no question.

    "What's Next", written by West Wing actresses Melissa Fitzgerald and Mary McCormack, was one of the books that I mentioned above. It gives great insight into the West Wing production team.

    Fitzgerald and McCormack were extremely warm in their praise for actor John Spencer, who played VP Leo McGarry. Spencer, another "Broadway" veteran, died before the West Wing series ended, and was missed terribly by everyone in the production company.

    One of the things that made "What's Next" so interesting is that it's just chock full of commentary from many of the people involved in the production. A good read.
  • So many great character actors on that show. Casting was superb! I recall them writing Leo McGarry out of the show with a deep reverence.
  • jeez,

    there generally is no such thing as a tipping point, as we geezer oldsters know from recent history

    it's only chipping away ! (resist!)

    did Kent State have an outcome? not really.

    yes, there were hearings and more.

    the bloody war went on 5 more years

    but it did end.

    Great point.

  • Leo McGarry was Chief of Staff, I recall. The Veep on the show was, according to the script, not well liked. But a fine actor; he was one of the student clowns on the road-trip in Animal House!
  • edited January 29
    @Old_Joe said, "actor John Spencer, who played VP Leo McGarry. Spencer, another "Broadway" veteran, died before the West Wing series ended, and was missed terribly by everyone in the production company."

    McGarry - Such a raw human character. I'm only in season 2. But did ask Siri once how old Spencer was and was saddened to learn he had passed. It's hard for me to believe the series first aired in 1999! Politics aside, it does feel much more modern.

    The Veep must be hiding under a desk somewhere. Has made a few appearances so far, but not an impressive or memorable character. But a lack of warmth between him and the Prez was evident.

    Animal House - another "goldie oldie " ...
  • I sit corrected: Crash is right- Leo McGarry was Chief of Staff, the Veep on the show was, according to the script, not well liked. Or trusted.

    I apologize for the sloppy reporting.
  • West Wing had THE best writers! And a marvelous cast. I recall some guest stars who showed up for just a few or several shows. One was the Protagonist in "Weeds." I roared laughing at those episodes. MARY LOUISE PARKER. So full of physical pulchritude.

    She was one of a pair who were platonic girlfriends in the film based on Fanny Flagg's book, "Fried Green Tomatoes" (at the Whistle Stop Cafe.)

    image
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