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Howdy @Derf Not all of our funds have posted current for today, so I don't know yet. As we have domestic and foreign equity, as well as bonds; some area may be in red any given day. Have you an example? Regards, Catch
Catch 22: I went back & took a peek At all 4 accounts. LC up, LCV down Energy down, Foreign down...... Total is off only -.01 JoJo26 the sky isn't falling yet ! Derf
Most markets did little either way today. My holdings were flat ( -$11 to be specific). My international equity index fund was the biggest loser at -.50%. So I'd guess perhaps you have some international exposure somewhere that was a drag. Could it be one of your funds is holding a slug of the FTSE Developed ex North America Index? Than again, maybe one or two of one of your funds' equity holdings had an off day.
Last night overseas markets tanked, largely due to N.Korea's buzzing Japan with the missile. U.S. futures were off sharply early in the morning, but recovered and the domestic markets bounced around most of the day. Gold had another good day and was my best performer.
Hi @Derf This "daily" Fidelity list provides a decent overview of all sectors. The list is fairly long, but starts with domestic equity, through int'l., sectors and then to bonds and other. Fund category style/type is listed slightly to the right in a column. You may look at the column for "NAV % change" to identify the happy and not as happy areas. This is an open list not requiring a log-in.
LOL - Nice list. Hard to imagine Fidelity or anybody else running that many different funds.
Occasionally I'll skim the YTD numbers at Price hoping to find some badly beaten up sector to throw a little $$ at for a quick gain. But it's been a "dry hole" this year. Nothing stands out as cheap.
Morn'in @hank Keep in mind the Fidelity fund list contains some redundant data as the mix is active managed and index funds, too. Of more particular value to some is the "sectors", Fidelity's "select" funds which allows a quick over view of managed funds in many sectors. As an historical note, in the way back days (early-late 80's); one could buy/sell the select funds on an hourly basis via touch tone phone (pre-internet days). A kinda front runner to today's etf's which may be traded whenever, not unlike a stock. The practice was eliminated, as too much volatility caused pricing actions problems. This trading was not free, and I recall a .75% fee of the value of the trade.
Interesting conundrum in energy markets. Most energy sectors like NYMEX and Brent have been flat or down this week. But one area, RBOB-Gas, has been hot, up about 6% in early morning trading. This relates to disruptions to gasoline refining and distribution caused by Harvey.
Catch - I do remember trading in Fidelity Select - sometime the 80s. They were traded a lot. And what I most recall is that if I was traveling and decided to make a trade within market hours I needed to pull off the road, deposit coins into a pay-phone at a phone booth, and execute the trade via live agent. (Mobile phones were rare.)
Note: Looks like Fidelity discontinued the hourly pricing feature in 2006. For the youngsters who don't remember phone booths, those were the small square structures on street corners Clark Kent used to use when he needed to change from street cloths into his Superman outfit.
Hi @Derf Pretty much the big green "UP" with everything today, eh? Been away from the homestead all day; but aware of up everywhere today. "China" direct is about the only area I find a bit down. 'Course, I do tend to pay more attention when the global equity and bond sectors have a fairly big "up" together. Shows me, to a point; that a lot of folks have dissimilar views of what is ahead. Yes ??? Take care, Catch
Had a few. I don't count the funds and etfs that had end of month diistributions . Two of my foreign funds down a smidge along with a couple of stocks but not by much. What i am finding the hardest thing right now is doing nothing. I have set some targets for a few etfs to add tobut the dern things keep going up
Not today - But one I watch, HSGFX, lost about a half percent. I started a thread a couple months back when it hit $6.66 - thinking that a pretty cool number. Alas, today it's at an even $6.50. Progress?
Yes sir , a nice day for stocks in general. I'm thinking of taking some gains for the year, in retirement accounts. I'm wondering if others have been taking some $$$ of the table ? Derf
Old_Skeet's portfolio which totals 47 funds ... for the day and for the week ... all green. And, currently, no red year-to-date or for the rolling twelve months either. The worst performing sleeve is my small/mid cap sleeve found in the growth area of the portfolio. And, the best performing sleeve is my specialty and theme sleeve which in also in the growth area of the portfolio. Overall, I am up just short of ten percent (9.8%) year-to-date while my bogey the Lipper Balanced Index is up about 8.8%. I'm thinking this is pretty good for an active fifty/fifty portfolio as the 50/50 index portfolio that I track is up about 7.6%. For the summer (June, July & August) I was up just short of two percent while the 50/50 index portfolio was up about the same.
By the calendar fall (September, October & November) is now here. I'm thinking my specialty and theme sleeve where my emerging market, business development and infrastructure funds are found will continue to perform while I look for my small/mid cap sleeve to pick the pace up. In addition, my global growth sleeve should continue to perform well along with my large/mid cap sleeve. If I were to do any near term buying it would be in my small/mid caps.
Seems, my time and energy spent becoming a student of the markets (although an econ major) has been worthwhile not only for enjoyment received but monetarily as well.
@hank A "just for the heck of it" look at HSGFX and FCNTX, starting with July of 2000 (as far backwards as the charting would provide). 'Course this start date is only a few months after the bit internet bubble popped in March of 2000; so a chart of that time frame would be interesting, too. There was indeed some type of mindset change that took place with HSGFX in 2012; although the change (downward) had already started to take place after the market(s) recovery in March of 2009. Personal note: attempting to avoid thread topic drift, but this thread title involving "red" and the chart for HSGFX are related, eh?
Old_Skeet's portfolio which totals 47 funds ... for the day and for the week ... all green. And, currently, no red year-to-date or for the rolling twelve months either. The worst performing sleeve is my small/mid cap sleeve found in the growth area of the portfolio. And, the best performing sleeve is my specialty and theme sleeve which in also in the growth area of the portfolio. Overall, I am up just short of ten percent (9.8%) year-to-date while my bogey the Lipper Balanced Index is up about 8.8%. I'm thinking this is pretty good for an active fifty/fifty portfolio as the 50/50 index portfolio that I track is up about 7.6%. For the summer (June, July & August) I was up just short of two percent while the 50/50 index portfolio was up about the same.
By the calendar fall (September, October & November) is now here. I'm thinking my specialty and theme sleeve where my emerging market, business development and infrastructure funds are found will continue to perform while I looking for my small/mid cap sleeve to pick the pace up. In addition, my global growth sleeve should continue to perform well along with my large/mid cap sleeve. If I were to do any near term buying it would be in my small/mid caps.
Seems, my time and energy spent becoming a student of the markets (although an econ major) has been worthwhile not only for enjoyment received but monetarily as well.
And, so-it-goes.
Old_Skeet
Why is it you never count the cash sleeve of your portfolio when computing returns. Probably the only investor I've ever known who does this. I believe some other posters jumped on you for this in the past but you just don't seem to get it.
Thanks for stating your position towards my portfolio reporting.
Yes, these are investment returns (excluding the cash sleeves) for mutual fund positions only. Look a couple post above mine with what Ted posted as his portfolio's return. For what it is worth, I'm not finding he listed any cash. So, with others eliminating cash with their performance reporting so have I; and, I generally report based upon invested assets which excludes the two cash sleeves. The portfolio's performance numbers come form Morningstar's Portfolio Manager and are tracked by position, by sleeve, and by the invested portfolio as a whole. Interestingly, for the portfolio as a whole Portfolio Manager only considers the mutual fund positions. Morningstar excludes the "CASH$" entry from performance reporting but includes it for portfolio total value. However, my brokerage house includes cash in their monthly statements for performance reporting. This way, I know it both ways.
Thanks for stating your position towards my portfolio reporting.
Yes, these are investment returns excluding the cash sleeves. Look a couple post above mine with what Ted posted as his portfolio's return. For what it is worth, I'm not finding he listed any cash. So, with others eliminating cash with their performance reporting so have I; and, I generally report based upon invested assets which excludes the cash sleeves.
Thanks again, for making comment.
Old_Skeet
A very flimsy excuse. Ted was just listing some individual holdings not his total portfolio returns. You have exaggerated your annualized returns for years on this forum because you conveniently omit cash.
Not so ... @Junkster, I started reporting both ways about a year ago. And, more recently reporting only investment returns. Where is it listed or detailed that there is a standard on the forum for performace reporting? Sorry, you are having difficulity with my post.
Remember, my portfolio as a whole includes multiple accounts and they are combined into one by using Morningstar's Portfolio Manager. If you have a great dislike for not including cash then the issue is not so much with me as I am using their tool to combine the portfolios. It seems, to me, your plight might be more with Morningstar.
Not so ... @Junkster, I started reporting both ways about a year ago. And, more recently reporting only investment returns. Where is it listed or detailed that there is a standard on the forum for performace reporting? Sorry, you are having difficulity with my post.
Curious, what is your performance with the cash sleeves included?
Not so ... @Junkster, I started reporting both ways about a year ago. And, more recently reporting only investment returns. Where is it listed or detailed that there is a standard on the forum for performace reporting? Sorry, you are having difficulity with my post.
Only because some jumped on you did you finally report returns including cash but you are back to your misleading ways. Let's see, someone who always holds 50 or so funds, who always refers to themselves in the third person and hasn't a clue how to figure their annualized returns? You seem a bit full of yourself at times. I would wager many participants here run circles around you when it comes to the growth of their portfolios. And no I am not referring to myself as this is not a hobby for me.
Old-Skeet, Isn't cash often a component of your mutual fund manager's overall holdings and therefore also included in M* Portfolio Manager performance?
I can understand Junkster point regarding overall portfolio performance as cash acts as a drag on positive returns for a portfolio, while cash also buoys overall negative returns.
I think cash is a very interesting investment topic that we spend little time discussing here at MFO.
Cash: Wallet Cash (your walking around folding money) Home Equity Cash (people using there house equity as an ATM) Under the Mattress Cash (emergency) Collectible Cash (coins, etc) Tag sale Cash (selling/buying items) Checks Cashed Here (for the bankless society) ECash - Bitcoin, paypal, any electronic bank cash Portfolio Cash- cash settling from a sell, cash as a personal investment position, cash as a component of a fund manager's fund portfolio.
Investors like Warren Buffet and there use a cash is a topic in itself. Warren's BOA cash Warrants is just one example of where cash is, well, King.
Moringstar does report cash held within a mutual fund in Xray ... but, for cash held outside in portfolio manager I've had to add it using the following symbol (in caps) "CASH$" on the data entry page of Portfolio Manager. To see and experience this first hand just open a portfolio in Portfolio Manager and in Xray as well. Enter your mutual fund ticker symbols and amounts held. Then view the portfolio and how the mutual funds collectively performed. To add cash held outside of the mutual funds enter this using "CASH$" and then the amount. Notice, the value of the portfolio changed but the performance of the invested assets did not in portfolio manager. Therefore, it seems Morningstar excludes "CASH$" held outside of the mutual funds themselves in computing performance. This is what I have observed and been more recently reporting ... The Morningstar Portfolio Manager performance number. In Xray you will notice the percent of cash held was increased with the entry along with changes in the allocation percentages.
Again ... I'm thinking the plight needs to be with Morningstar ... not with me ... since, it is their investment tools that are being used to derive these numbers.
Moringstar does report cash held within a mutual fund in Xray ... but, for cash held outside in portfolio manager I've had to add it using the following symbol (in caps) "CASH$" on the data entry page of Portfolio Manager. To see and experience this first hand just open a portfolio in Portfolio Manager and in Xray as well. Enter your mutual fund ticker symbols and amounts held. Then view the portfolio and how the mutual funds collectively performed. To add cash held outside of the mutual funds enter this using "CASH$" and then the amount. Notice, the value of the portfolio changed but the performance of the invested assets did not. Therefore, it seems Morningstar excludes "CASH$" held outside of the mutual funds themselves in computing performance. This is what I have observed and been more recently reporting ... The Morningstar Portfolio Manager performance number.
Again ... I'm thinking the plight needs to be with them ... not with me ... since, it tends to only include invested assets and excludes the cash position.
Old_Skeet
I think the whole point here is that the "investment" returns you cited are misleading as @junkster said. So I wouldn't pawn that off on M*.
I've rarely posted returns - and am always wary about doing so. But have on occasion alluded to an attempt to track/mimic a good 40/60 fund, TRRIX, over longer periods. (The idea is to make sure I'm not substantially underperforming.) Yearly results normally deviate (in both directions) from that benchmark.
For my own personal use only, I always include cash in my calculations. I'm pretty sure the managers of TRRIX also include cash in that fund's performance reporting.
Great stuff from @bee. It's amazing how something as simple as "cash" becomes very complicated when you start slicing & dicing.
Thanks for the suggestion (AOM). I've grown used to TRRIX. A long-term devote of Price. So probably understand this fund-of-funds and the underlying funds it invests in better than others. And probably understand Price's investment approach/ philosophy better than others. I also own a modest amount of TRRIX (roughly 10% of total).
I think where we small investors have a bit of an advantage over a fund like that is that we can be more nimble. (Buffet often makes a similar point - that smaller amounts are easier to manage.) Can cut either way of course.
One can (and I do) look at performance results of multiple funds and indexes. So I'd hesitate to put too much emphasis on comparisons with TRRIX or any other. All info is valuable.
It's amazing how something as simple as "cash" becomes very complicated when you start slicing & dicing.
Just returned from my town dump... which holds a "cash" account that automatically replenishes itself when I get "down in the dumps". I carry this cash account around in my car on a transponder reader. Oh, and it's right next to my Sun Pass and EZ Pass transponders that also require that I carry cash balance on the accounts for toll charges.
While I'm reaching into my wallet often for folding money I at times pull out cash substitutes in the form of gift cards and promotional VISA cash cards.
Shhhhish...
I'm headed out right now to get some cash back that I was pre-charged for all those returnable sodas, beers, and waters containers.
Comments
Not all of our funds have posted current for today, so I don't know yet.
As we have domestic and foreign equity, as well as bonds; some area may be in red any given day.
Have you an example?
Regards,
Catch
JoJo26 the sky isn't falling yet !
Derf
Most markets did little either way today. My holdings were flat ( -$11 to be specific).
My international equity index fund was the biggest loser at -.50%. So I'd guess perhaps you have some international exposure somewhere that was a drag. Could it be one of your funds is holding a slug of the FTSE Developed ex North America Index? Than again, maybe one or two of one of your funds' equity holdings had an off day.
Last night overseas markets tanked, largely due to N.Korea's buzzing Japan with the missile. U.S. futures were off sharply early in the morning, but recovered and the domestic markets bounced around most of the day. Gold had another good day and was my best performer.
Hope this sheds some light.
This "daily" Fidelity list provides a decent overview of all sectors. The list is fairly long, but starts with domestic equity, through int'l., sectors and then to bonds and other. Fund category style/type is listed slightly to the right in a column.
You may look at the column for "NAV % change" to identify the happy and not as happy areas.
This is an open list not requiring a log-in.
http://fundresearch.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/fidelity-funds-daily-pricing-yields?refpr=MFRes_016
Say goodnight, Catch.
Goodnight.....
Take care,
Catch
LOL - Nice list. Hard to imagine Fidelity or anybody else running that many different funds.
Occasionally I'll skim the YTD numbers at Price hoping to find some badly beaten up sector to throw a little $$ at for a quick gain. But it's been a "dry hole" this year. Nothing stands out as cheap.
Regards
Keep in mind the Fidelity fund list contains some redundant data as the mix is active managed and index funds, too.
Of more particular value to some is the "sectors", Fidelity's "select" funds which allows a quick over view of managed funds in many sectors.
As an historical note, in the way back days (early-late 80's); one could buy/sell the select funds on an hourly basis via touch tone phone (pre-internet days). A kinda front runner to today's etf's which may be traded whenever, not unlike a stock. The practice was eliminated, as too much volatility caused pricing actions problems. This trading was not free, and I recall a .75% fee of the value of the trade.
Catch - I do remember trading in Fidelity Select - sometime the 80s. They were traded a lot. And what I most recall is that if I was traveling and decided to make a trade within market hours I needed to pull off the road, deposit coins into a pay-phone at a phone booth, and execute the trade via live agent. (Mobile phones were rare.)
Note: Looks like Fidelity discontinued the hourly pricing feature in 2006. For the youngsters who don't remember phone booths, those were the small square structures on street corners Clark Kent used to use when he needed to change from street cloths into his Superman outfit.
Pretty much the big green "UP" with everything today, eh?
Been away from the homestead all day; but aware of up everywhere today.
"China" direct is about the only area I find a bit down.
'Course, I do tend to pay more attention when the global equity and bond sectors have a fairly big "up" together. Shows me, to a point; that a lot of folks have dissimilar views of what is ahead. Yes ???
Take care,
Catch
Derf
No red for the Linkster !
Regards,
Ted
PRHSX= +1.81%
QQQ= + 1.07%
TRBCX= + 0.87%
SPY= +0.60%
PFF= + 0.39%
PBDCX= + 0.19%
PONCX= + 0.08%
Old_Skeet's portfolio which totals 47 funds ... for the day and for the week ... all green. And, currently, no red year-to-date or for the rolling twelve months either. The worst performing sleeve is my small/mid cap sleeve found in the growth area of the portfolio. And, the best performing sleeve is my specialty and theme sleeve which in also in the growth area of the portfolio. Overall, I am up just short of ten percent (9.8%) year-to-date while my bogey the Lipper Balanced Index is up about 8.8%. I'm thinking this is pretty good for an active fifty/fifty portfolio as the 50/50 index portfolio that I track is up about 7.6%. For the summer (June, July & August) I was up just short of two percent while the 50/50 index portfolio was up about the same.
By the calendar fall (September, October & November) is now here. I'm thinking my specialty and theme sleeve where my emerging market, business development and infrastructure funds are found will continue to perform while I look for my small/mid cap sleeve to pick the pace up. In addition, my global growth sleeve should continue to perform well along with my large/mid cap sleeve. If I were to do any near term buying it would be in my small/mid caps.
Seems, my time and energy spent becoming a student of the markets (although an econ major) has been worthwhile not only for enjoyment received but monetarily as well.
And, so-it-goes.
Old_Skeet
A "just for the heck of it" look at HSGFX and FCNTX, starting with July of 2000 (as far backwards as the charting would provide). 'Course this start date is only a few months after the bit internet bubble popped in March of 2000; so a chart of that time frame would be interesting, too.
There was indeed some type of mindset change that took place with HSGFX in 2012; although the change (downward) had already started to take place after the market(s) recovery in March of 2009.
Personal note: attempting to avoid thread topic drift, but this thread title involving "red" and the chart for HSGFX are related, eh?
http://stockcharts.com/freecharts/perf.php?HSGFX,FCNTX&n=4305&O=011000
Thanks for stating your position towards my portfolio reporting.
Yes, these are investment returns (excluding the cash sleeves) for mutual fund positions only. Look a couple post above mine with what Ted posted as his portfolio's return. For what it is worth, I'm not finding he listed any cash. So, with others eliminating cash with their performance reporting so have I; and, I generally report based upon invested assets which excludes the two cash sleeves. The portfolio's performance numbers come form Morningstar's Portfolio Manager and are tracked by position, by sleeve, and by the invested portfolio as a whole. Interestingly, for the portfolio as a whole Portfolio Manager only considers the mutual fund positions. Morningstar excludes the "CASH$" entry from performance reporting but includes it for portfolio total value. However, my brokerage house includes cash in their monthly statements for performance reporting. This way, I know it both ways.
Thanks again, for making comment.
Old_Skeet
Remember, my portfolio as a whole includes multiple accounts and they are combined into one by using Morningstar's Portfolio Manager. If you have a great dislike for not including cash then the issue is not so much with me as I am using their tool to combine the portfolios. It seems, to me, your plight might be more with Morningstar.
Old-Skeet, Isn't cash often a component of your mutual fund manager's overall holdings and therefore also included in M* Portfolio Manager performance?
I can understand Junkster point regarding overall portfolio performance as cash acts as a drag on positive returns for a portfolio, while cash also buoys overall negative returns.
I think cash is a very interesting investment topic that we spend little time discussing here at MFO.
Cash:
Wallet Cash (your walking around folding money)
Home Equity Cash (people using there house equity as an ATM)
Under the Mattress Cash (emergency)
Collectible Cash (coins, etc)
Tag sale Cash (selling/buying items)
Checks Cashed Here (for the bankless society)
ECash - Bitcoin, paypal, any electronic bank cash
Portfolio Cash- cash settling from a sell, cash as a personal investment position, cash as a component of a fund manager's fund portfolio.
Investors like Warren Buffet and there use a cash is a topic in itself. Warren's BOA cash Warrants is just one example of where cash is, well, King.
Moringstar does report cash held within a mutual fund in Xray ... but, for cash held outside in portfolio manager I've had to add it using the following symbol (in caps) "CASH$" on the data entry page of Portfolio Manager. To see and experience this first hand just open a portfolio in Portfolio Manager and in Xray as well. Enter your mutual fund ticker symbols and amounts held. Then view the portfolio and how the mutual funds collectively performed. To add cash held outside of the mutual funds enter this using "CASH$" and then the amount. Notice, the value of the portfolio changed but the performance of the invested assets did not in portfolio manager. Therefore, it seems Morningstar excludes "CASH$" held outside of the mutual funds themselves in computing performance. This is what I have observed and been more recently reporting ... The Morningstar Portfolio Manager performance number. In Xray you will notice the percent of cash held was increased with the entry along with changes in the allocation percentages.
Again ... I'm thinking the plight needs to be with Morningstar ... not with me ... since, it is their investment tools that are being used to derive these numbers.
Old_Skeet
I've rarely posted returns - and am always wary about doing so. But have on occasion alluded to an attempt to track/mimic a good 40/60 fund, TRRIX, over longer periods. (The idea is to make sure I'm not substantially underperforming.) Yearly results normally deviate (in both directions) from that benchmark.
For my own personal use only, I always include cash in my calculations. I'm pretty sure the managers of TRRIX also include cash in that fund's performance reporting.
Great stuff from @bee. It's amazing how something as simple as "cash" becomes very complicated when you start slicing & dicing.
If you ever get tired of TRRIX, AOM is neck and neck with it, marginally outperforming the last few years.
Thanks for the suggestion (AOM). I've grown used to TRRIX. A long-term devote of Price. So probably understand this fund-of-funds and the underlying funds it invests in better than others. And probably understand Price's investment approach/ philosophy better than others. I also own a modest amount of TRRIX (roughly 10% of total).
I think where we small investors have a bit of an advantage over a fund like that is that we can be more nimble. (Buffet often makes a similar point - that smaller amounts are easier to manage.) Can cut either way of course.
One can (and I do) look at performance results of multiple funds and indexes. So I'd hesitate to put too much emphasis on comparisons with TRRIX or any other. All info is valuable.
Regards
While I'm reaching into my wallet often for folding money I at times pull out cash substitutes in the form of gift cards and promotional VISA cash cards.
Shhhhish...
I'm headed out right now to get some cash back that I was pre-charged for all those returnable sodas, beers, and waters containers.
Mostly beer.