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"Core" Bond Fund Replacement

edited September 26 in Fund Discussions
I will transfer the pre-tax portion of my 401(k) to a Rollover IRA and need to replace the bond fund — DOXIX.
DOXIX is a good fund which resides in the M* Intermediate Core-Plus category.
I've expanded the search beyond Intermediate Core and Intermediate Core-Plus bond funds
that many investors utilize for their primary fixed income positions.

Desirable characteristics are listed below.

at least 5 years of operating history but preferably more than 10 years¹
short-to-intermediate term duration
typically holds < 20% high-yield bonds
typically holds < 20% EM bonds
low/moderate volatility and max drawdowns
expense ratio preferably < 1.00%

Here are several funds which are/were being considered (~dozen others were reviewed).

PFIIX
PGBIX
WCPBX
GBOAX (too much high-yield, lots of EM also)
DODLX (good trailing returns, low expenses, too volatile)

I've read the posts in the Low Risk Bond OEFs for Maturing CDs thread.
I'm open to your suggestions — thanks in advance!


¹ Unless portfolio managers ran other funds with a similar strategy for > 5 years.

Comments

  • Just browsing my watch list for bond funds =>BBB, with SD and duration <=WCPBX I see: BILTX, FIIFX, FATRX, FTHRX, BIMIX, HWDYX. I don't know your comfort level with securitised debt, so you'll have to examine the funds individually.

    If you have a subscription to MFO Premium your stated criteria should yield good results.
  • @WABAC,

    Thanks for your suggestions!
    I've previously checked FATRX and FTHRX but will look into the other funds.
  • Another class of DOXIX (ER 33 bps) is DODIX (ER 43 bps). BCOIX (ER 33 bps) is good too.
  • @Observant1: I know that you are familiar with VCPAX and while it does not meet all your desirable characteristics, it looks like a good core-plus bond fund with a low ER of 20 bps.
  • My question starts with why do you need a core bond fund?
    I looked at CBLDX and IMO, it's better than all the funds above.
    I checked from 1-1-2020 and it's number one.
    For one year it's not number 1, but it's still among the top.
    And it's the best risk/reward fund, AKA Sharpe.
    It still pays about 5.3% yearly dist based on last month.

    The manager's track record is known.
  • edited September 26
    So I queried MFO P with my morning coffee, because I like queries. Here is what I came up with:

    Basic Info
    • Asset Universe: Mutual Funds
    • SubType: Bond
    • Age, years: 10+
    Index? No Index Funds
    More Basic Info
    • Share Class: All Classes (Note: This option takes longer to load, initially.)
    • Fund of Funds? No Fund of Funds
    More Risk Metrics
    • DSDEV Rating: 1 - 2 Below Average
    • Down Rating (In Type): 1 - 2 Bottom Quintile
    Purchase Info
    • Expense Ratio (ER), %/yr: 1.00 or Less
    Bond Info
    • Quality: BBB or Better
    • Junk Plus Non-Rated: 20% or Less
    • Duration: 6 Years or Less
    • Effective Duration: 6 Years or Less

    I set the time period from 202112. There were few results over three years of effective duration, which is not too surprising given the environment we have been in. Here they are by duration length, then lowest ER of the fund without regard to purchase conditions: FIJEX, PGBIX, SNGVX, VCFIX. HWDVX, FPNIX.

    When I looked at the results for the last twelve months there were no funds with a duration over 2.3. It has been a bumpy flight.

    So then I dialed out to ten years and ended up with PGBIX, SNGVX, HWDVX, and FPNIX.

    I might try dialing up the risk factor a little later today, but I think this post has gone on long enough.
  • Here are several funds which are/were being considered ... WCPBX

    I was going to ask how you would purchase WCPBX, or in the alternative say wow, I'm impressed, $1M min in most places.

    But upon checking, I see that Vanguard offers it with a $500 min. Any other ways to access it?

    WABAC mentioned possible concerns over large amounts of securitized debt (presumably with its distinctive risk profile). DODIX holds 50% in securitized debt. Perhaps that is why its drawdown 8/1/21 to 10/31/22 (using monthly performance figures) was -15.11% (per M*). And its risk score (again, M*) is 16, which is a little high if one is looking for a moderately conservative bond fund.

    The point is that in stretching constraints a bit one can sometimes turn up an interesting prospect. (Mona made the same point.)

    With that in mind, TSIIX may be worth a look. Taking together both its junk rated (19.31%) and its unrated (5.57%) bonds, its remaining (IG) holdings are a bit under your 80% min target. And its securitized holdings, though less than those of D&C (3/8 vs 4/8) are still substantial.

    Counterbalancing this is its superior stability (3,5,10 yr std devs all around 4) and a max drawdown between 10/1/21 and 10/31/22 (monthly performance) of "just" -8.09% (M*).

    Personally I like the fact that its portfolio allocations can change significantly. But that does mean that you would run the risk of it meandering well outside your guardrails from time to time.
  • edited September 26
    When I have responded to the OP in this thread I have tried to keep in mind that he just might know his own druthers better than I do.

    If I was looking to creep out on the duration limb I might look at similar constraints.

    But, you know . . .

    So I tacked CBLDX onto my query.

    I did not put a duration floor on my query, and it should go without saying that the funds mentioned below will have much less of it.

    I'm not making any adjustments in the ranking for multiple share classes.

    At five years CBLDX would have given you the better Sharp, but BATPX would have returned 8.2 vs 6.1

    At four years CBLDX wins on Sharp, but is outperformed by BATPX, LCTIX, and ENIAX.

    At three years CBLDX still leads on Sharp. There are now seven funds ahead in performance one of which is ENIAX only .12 behind in the Sharp race.

    At 2.5 years CBLDX falls to 16th place on Sharp. It ties for 6th place on returns.

    At two years CBLDX drops down to 20th place on Sharp. It ties for 9th place on returns.

    At 1.5 years CBLDX is way down there on Sharp. It's down to 10th place on returns.

    At one year CBLDX falls to 29th place on Sharp. It's now back up to 6th place on returns.

    MFO Premium works on month to month numbers. If you have a way to track daily performance then your results may differ.

    I did the ranks by human-powered eyeball, so let me know if you see an error when you run the query as I have.
  • edited September 26
    Mona said:

    @Observant1: I know that you are familiar with VCPAX and while it does not meet all
    your desirable characteristics, it looks like a good core-plus bond fund with a low ER of 20 bps.

    Thanks, Mona!
  • edited September 26
    WABAC said:

    So I queried MFO P with my morning coffee, because I like queries. Here is what I came up with:

    Basic Info
    • Asset Universe: Mutual Funds
    • SubType: Bond
    • Age, years: 10+
    Index? No Index Funds
    More Basic Info
    • Share Class: All Classes (Note: This option takes longer to load, initially.)
    • Fund of Funds? No Fund of Funds
    More Risk Metrics
    • DSDEV Rating: 1 - 2 Below Average
    • Down Rating (In Type): 1 - 2 Bottom Quintile
    Purchase Info
    • Expense Ratio (ER), %/yr: 1.00 or Less
    Bond Info
    • Quality: BBB or Better
    • Junk Plus Non-Rated: 20% or Less
    • Duration: 6 Years or Less
    • Effective Duration: 6 Years or Less

    I set the time period from 202112. There were few results over three years of effective duration, which is not too surprising given the environment we have been in. Here they are by duration length, then lowest ER of the fund without regard to purchase conditions: FIJEX, PGBIX, SNGVX, VCFIX. HWDVX, FPNIX.

    When I looked at the results for the last twelve months there were no funds with a duration over 2.3. It has been a bumpy flight.

    So then I dialed out to ten years and ended up with PGBIX, SNGVX, HWDVX, and FPNIX.

    I might try dialing up the risk factor a little later today, but I think this post has gone on long enough.


    Thanks, WABAC.
    You've given me lots of homework to do!
  • edited September 26
    msf said:

    Here are several funds which are/were being considered ... WCPBX

    I was going to ask how you would purchase WCPBX, or in the alternative say wow, I'm impressed, $1M min in most places.

    But upon checking, I see that Vanguard offers it with a $500 min. Any other ways to access it?

    WABAC mentioned possible concerns over large amounts of securitized debt (presumably with its distinctive risk profile). DODIX holds 50% in securitized debt. Perhaps that is why its drawdown 8/1/21 to 10/31/22 (using monthly performance figures) was -15.11% (per M*). And its risk score (again, M*) is 16, which is a little high if one is looking for a moderately conservative bond fund.

    The point is that in stretching constraints a bit one can sometimes turn up an interesting prospect. (Mona made the same point.)

    With that in mind, TSIIX may be worth a look. Taking together both its junk rated (19.31%) and its unrated (5.57%) bonds, its remaining (IG) holdings are a bit under your 80% min target. And its securitized holdings, though less than those of D&C (3/8 vs 4/8) are still substantial.

    Counterbalancing this is its superior stability (3,5,10 yr std devs all around 4) and a max drawdown between 10/1/21 and 10/31/22 (monthly performance) of "just" -8.09% (M*).

    Personally I like the fact that its portfolio allocations can change significantly. But that does mean that you would run the risk of it meandering well outside your guardrails from time to time.

    Yes, I'll have access to WCPBX via Vanguard.
    I'm not aware of any other brokerages which allow access to this fund
    with a low minimum investment but haven't conducted extensive research.
    I'll look into TSIIX.
    Thanks!
  • edited September 26
    FD1000 said:

    My question starts with why do you need a core bond fund?
    I looked at CBLDX and IMO, it's better than all the funds above.
    I checked from 1-1-2020 and it's number one.
    For one year it's not number 1, but it's still among the top.
    And it's the best risk/reward fund, AKA Sharpe.
    It still pays about 5.3% yearly dist based on last month.

    The manager's track record is known.

    Thanks, FD1000.
    To complement my equity holdings, I'm seeking a primary bond fund with the potential
    for higher future returns than DODIX or BCOIX without assuming too much risk.
    CBLDX is an excellent fund and David Sherman is a talented portfolio manager.
    However, CBLDX has a greater allocation to below investment-grade bonds
    than I'm comfortable holding within my primary bond fund.
    I am considering this fund as a potential satellite position
    with a considerably smaller allocation in a different account.
    I also like RCTIX and ICMUX for this role.

    CBLDX as of 06/30/2025 (M*)
    BB - 10.79%
    B - 24.24%
    Below B - 0.20%
    Not Rated - 26.75%

    RCTIX as of 08/31/2025 (River Canyon)
    BB - 14%
    B - 22%
    Below B - 10%
    Not Rated - 19%

    ICMUX as of 06/30/2025 (Intrepid Capital)
    BB - 30.8%
    B - 30.7%
    Below B - 7.3%
    Not Rated - 20.9%
  • edited September 26
    If you are comfortable with the risk, then ICMUX looks better than CBLDX and RCTIX.

    CBLDX=I don't pay too much attention to ratings and a lot more to actual performance,risk,SD. Sherman proved it already.

    TSIIX lags CBLDX for 1-3 years. No go.
    WCPBX made just 10% in 5 years. No go.
    Anything VG bond funds is always a no-go for me, including VCPAX.
    BATPX: too volatile. No go
    LCTIX: higher SD than CBLDX, lower performance for 1 year. Higher for 3-5.
    ENIAX: similar to CBLDX
    ICMUX: more volatility but the best return for 1-3-5 years.

    Now, it depends on your allocation, style, and how long you hold. I always invested in bond funds with good risk/reward but also great performance. Never high-rated bond funds.
  • WABAC said:

    So I queried MFO P with my morning coffee, because I like queries. Here is what I came up with:

    Basic Info
    • Asset Universe: Mutual Funds
    • SubType: Bond
    • Age, years: 10+
    Index? No Index Funds
    More Basic Info
    • Share Class: All Classes (Note: This option takes longer to load, initially.)
    • Fund of Funds? No Fund of Funds
    More Risk Metrics
    • DSDEV Rating: 1 - 2 Below Average
    • Down Rating (In Type): 1 - 2 Bottom Quintile
    Purchase Info
    • Expense Ratio (ER), %/yr: 1.00 or Less
    Bond Info
    • Quality: BBB or Better
    • Junk Plus Non-Rated: 20% or Less
    • Duration: 6 Years or Less
    • Effective Duration: 6 Years or Less

    I set the time period from 202112. There were few results over three years of effective duration, which is not too surprising given the environment we have been in. Here they are by duration length, then lowest ER of the fund without regard to purchase conditions: FIJEX, PGBIX, SNGVX, VCFIX. HWDVX, FPNIX.

    When I looked at the results for the last twelve months there were no funds with a duration over 2.3. It has been a bumpy flight.

    So then I dialed out to ten years and ended up with PGBIX, SNGVX, HWDVX, and FPNIX.

    I might try dialing up the risk factor a little later today, but I think this post has gone on long enough.


    Thanks, WABAC.
    You've given me lots of homework to do!
    That Hartford fund has more derivatives, and what-not, than the PIMCO fund. That's quite an achievement.:-D

    Neither are the kind of thing I would go in for. But I had fun with the query.

    I might take a longer look at some of the shorter duration funds that showed up. People are a little too comfortable with "inflation in line with expectations" to tempt me further out on the duration limb than I already am.
  • I had fun with the query

    Exactly! That's a big motivator in commenting on some threads.

    I may have a sense of what Observant1 is looking for. As I tried to prune my portfolio I sought a reasonably behaved solid bond fund to anchor the fixed income side of my portfolio. Something that would return more than cash-ish or run of the mill short-ish funds. I don't look at long duration (these funds are more suitable for bets on interest rates than for long term, stable holdings). I'm willing to take on some credit risk but not sink into a junk-heavy portfolio. And preferably a core fund would have a long track record from a well regarded money manager.

    On the one hand, one can stretch boundaries a bit to avoid lagging. OTOH, one tries to avoid taking on fundamental risks regardless of how well behaved the fund appears to be. Performance, even risk adjusted performance is not the end all.

    In the interest of partial disclosure:-) I'll say that I've owned or do own more than one of the funds already mentioned. This is just to suggest that I've been looking around for what I think are similar reasons.

    I've taken a careful look at CBLDX but like Observant1 don't feel it is good in a core position. Rather, I could use it to stretch risk in my near-cash (0-5 year) sleeve. For that satellite role I find it a close call.
  • edited September 26
    "On the one hand, one can stretch boundaries a bit to avoid lagging.
    OTOH, one tries to avoid taking on fundamental risks regardless of how well behaved the fund appears to be. Performance, even risk adjusted performance is not the end all."


    Very well said, sir!
  • "On the one hand, one can stretch boundaries a bit to avoid lagging.
    OTOH, one tries to avoid taking on fundamental risks regardless of how well behaved the fund appears to be. Performance, even risk adjusted performance is not the end all."


    Very well said, sir!

    I have always understood this to be the point of bonds. I understand that other people approach them differently.

  • msf said:

    I had fun with the query

    Exactly! That's a big motivator in commenting on some threads.
    .

    I wouldn't be here but for MFO P.

    I spent some part of my working life selling raw data to people looking for answers. Some people asked better questions than others.

    I really enjoyed @Observant1's specificity.
  • EGRIX, CRDOX, ICMUX and APHPX is what I would be looking at for low(ish) vol and higher than MM returns.
  • BOXX too with the caveat of min holding of 1 year
  • edited September 26
    I've taken a careful look at CBLDX but like Observant1 don't feel it is good in a core position. Rather, I could use it to stretch risk in my near-cash (0-5 year) sleeve. For that satellite role I find it a close call.
    Core has different meanings to different investors.
    If DODIX is considered core for many, I would invest twice in CBLDX as my core. I rather have a great manager, with small AUM that knows how to select bonds and navigate markets.
    BTW, I have been posting for several years about the following 3 funds managed by Sherman from less risky to more RPHIX(great "sub" MM), CBLDX, and RSIIX.

    3 year Sharpe based on MFO...DODIX=0..........CBLDX=1.8 and...RSIIX=1.25.
    5 year Sharpe based on MFO...DODIX=(-0.3)...CBLDX=1.8 and...RSIIX=1.4.
  • edited September 27
    I’ve never cared much for plain vanilla bond funds. Rate risk is the most troubling aspect. If you’re investing to stay ahead of inflation, rates are likely to rise if inflation picks up which diminishes a bond’s value. There are work arounds like staying on the short end or buying individual TIPS. PIMCO seems to know how to game the system and stand up reasonably well regardless of rate environment. Not meant to exclude other managers.

    There are rate-hedged investment grade bond funds / etfs which provide the income stream of longer dated maturities without subjecting you to much rate risk. These sell Treasury’s short to offset rising rates in their long term holdings. IGHG and AGZD are a couple I’ve owned. AGZD is higher quality. I’d probably do a 50/50 split. Of course, if inflation and interest rates fall, as they did for much of the past 30 years, you’re better off in conventional bonds.

    And I think that 25+ year period probably distorts a lot of what we perceive when researching funds’ past performance.
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